Question of the Day

[gmatical]

Checking the flop, in my mind, is by far the most +EV play here for villains range.

If villain check raises your flop bet, how many times would you fold on the flop or on later streets if villain takes the lead?

How many times would you fold if villain calls flop bet and then takes lead on later streets?

My belief is our hand has huge showdown value and therefore pot control is of paramount importance.

I have him on a wider range than you lot. I would think a loose reg would defend a positional raise with a huge variety of suited connectors and the raise is still ripe to 'set mine' (god I hate that term).
I like a bet to see if it induces an insta-fold (which happens alot if he plays the range I am thinking.

If he takes the lead on the turn, I am endorsing a re-raise. I am just trying to win or find out if I am beat. If he comes back over the top - curse and fold.

If he has the tight range you suggest, then the small pot attitude is safer.

I would spew if he rolls KK tho (which is well and truly in both of our ranges.)

[maccatak11]

I really do not think that even a loosish reg will call 3-bets with suited connectors and low pairs OOP. Its just retarded. And the point of this whole post, is that even if they do have a bad hand as you suggest, we want to get value from these hands but inducing a bluff/light call from them on later streets.

If we bet straight away (1) we get raised off our hand or (2) we win no more than we already have.

[gmatical]

I really do not think that even a loosish reg will call 3-bets with suited connectors and low pairs OOP. Its just retarded. And the point of this whole post, is that even if they do have a bad hand as you suggest, we want to get value from these hands but inducing a bluff/light call from them on later streets.

If we bet straight away (1) we get raised off our hand or (2) we win no more than we already have.

I have realised that is where we differ. I play cash @ crown and the looseish regs i am thinking of do this all too often. Ive seen the same @ Star City. I have never played poker in SA, but i would expect the same. Their opinion is often "forget position, my opponent clearly has a good hand, if my 6 7 sooted hits (flushs, straights, sets, trips, 2 pairs, flush draws, straight draws) there is a good chance that I will stack him or check and get checked behind at catch a free card.


We aint got the nuts, 'value' is not at the forefront of my mind. I would be happy to take it down when we are heads up in a pot that is checked to us.

Regardless of his range, I want to take a swing at this pot early rather then later.

Would you call a $50 river bet ?

[maccatak11]

I would call a $50 river bet if it was checked before us yes. we have a great bluff catcher.

[Garth Kay]

So let's put Villain on a very wide range, say top 40% of hands? and include ALL suited connectors and suited one gap connectors we find we have a fair amount of equity on the flop.

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt
443,520 games 0.254 secs 1,746,141 games/sec

Board: Ad 5s 2c
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 36.689% 35.88% 00.81% 159134 3589.00 { 44+, A2s+, K2s+, Q4s+, J7s+, T7s+, 97s+, 86s+, 75s+, 64s+, 53s+, 42s+, 32s, A3o+, K7o+, Q8o+, J8o+, T9o }
Hand 1: 63.311% 62.50% 00.81% 277208 3589.00 { QhQs }


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Now I will add this; this hand will not get checked to the river 80% of the time, if not more. There isn't many turn cards we won't bet at if villain checks to us and there isn't many turn cards we will fold to if villain leads.

Also if villain does have that wide a range then I want him to see a turn card and hopefully pick up a draw that he is willing to call down with. My equity increases even more if villain is on a draw.

I won't even enter the live vs. online debate but the "I Play cash at a casino regularly and see this all the time" comment is valid, I too play at Crown and other casinos and against the majority of opponents in the live setting checking behind on this board IS the optimum play against loose regulars.

[bennymacca]

decent but loose-ish regular

gmatical, i think you are mis-interpreting the meaning of "regular"

normally in this context it means good, winning player.

so this statement above, i would determine as a loose-aggressive player, that wins at these stakes.


now, if this was changed to "loose fish" then the scenario would change dramatically, and it would be a whole other discussion. if you want we can change it to this scenario.

the people that play loose at the casino that you talk about are very rarely "decent"