Feedback on playing ability

[stevo]

You have to raise and make them pay for drawing as that way you will get better EV in the long run. If you put a raise in and they don't call then all is good and you take the pot right there, if they do call then you want to make sure you make them pay for the times they don't hit.

For example:
If you are ahead and they are drawing for up and down straight then they are roughly 2:1 underdog. If the pot is 100 and you only bet 10 into the pot on flop and turn and they call then in terms of EV it is roughly +73 (win 120 66% of the time and lose 20 x 33%). If you increased the bet to say 100 for the flop and turn then EV goes up to +133 (win 300 x 66% and lose 200 x 33%).

If you are ahead then the EV will always go up for a bigger bet. So if you know you are ahead it's better to make them pay for the draw. I guess the only time things get a little skewed are in a tourney when chips don't have equal values and so the chips you win are worth less than the chips you lose, so you have to weigh up how much you are willing to lose if they do hit. I'm still inclined to make them pay for the draw though.

[bennymacca]

i agree with what you are saying steve, but you are missing the point slightly

these circumstances i am talking about are in LIMIT holdem, where you can't change your bet size. so the difference between a bet of 10 and a bet of 100 doesn't come into play

Embrace the variance. If they are gonna chase draws, they'll more than likely miss the next time.

this is right, ill still be stuffing my chips in there

its just a lot harder in limit poker, as you are waay more susceptible to getting drawn out on

[Origami]

i am not talking preflop here, i am definitely raising preflop




in these circumstances, they are pretty much gonna call regardless of what you do, and its a big hit to your stack when they do hit their flush.

is it better to take a smaller pot, even though you are in front, with the chance[ skill- play the percentages ]that they will draw and take it down, or do you get your money in and just hope [ luck ] they dont hit the draw.

for me the essence of Poker .... raise, check fold.

you raise.. get your chips in

me... check/ fold ..................who wins ?? luck/ or the percentages

take Garths AA vs JJ 83% AA takes the win 17% lose....

course heads up a little different..... , but he was smarter than the ' average ' and he was there and has the bikkies to prove it...

remember tomorrow is another Day ... may I live long enough to see many tomorrows

[stevo]

i agree with what you are saying steve, but you are missing the point slightly

these circumstances i am talking about are in LIMIT holdem, where you can't change your bet size. so the difference between a bet of 10 and a bet of 100 doesn't come into play

Sorry, forgot you were talking about Limit

Although you did mention the raise raise play which is kinda similar to a bigger initial raise on no limit (i.e. you are increasing the amount the other person has to call, although they have already committed earlier bets into the pot which does change things). Obviously if the other person only calls your first raise then you can't make them pay further on that street but the point is that if you can you should make them put more into the pot when they are drawing to extract maximum value. You are right though, limit changes things slightly where someone wanting to draw can do so cheaper in no-limit (providing an opponent would bet larger in NL) by just calling.

[AceLosesKing]

I hate limit, for those very reasons. Pot Limit you can at least induce people to fold.

[bennymacca]

i have been trying out different games rather than just the NL holdem tourney, as i think that this will make me a better player in the long run (although i probably won't be as profitable in the short term, but i am not looking to be a pro anyway)

as well as the NL tourneys which i play regularly, i have been playing omaha hi/lo, and also horse. i have ever really played the stud games before, and i am enjoying them, especially razz. stud hilo is just annoying, because unlike omaha hilo, its pretty hard to draw to both the high and lo hand, unless u are making the wheel. the other anoying thing about stud is that u dont get to see the hand you would have made after you have folded

[rcon]

I hate limit, for those very reasons. Pot Limit you can at least induce people to fold.

Hating something because it is difficult is so very counter productive

[Des]

I suck at poker.

Thank you.

See you at state finals

[Bacon]

Hating something because it is difficult is so very counter productive

That's why I hate playing against you.

[Nevah play JJ]

Hi and thanks all for your answers.

Everything you all said is really good.

Pete: One of the things you said was be specific, so here are the areas I would kill to know about from the get go

Facial expressions, or tells?
What do I do that is predictable?
How do you get past fear of calling?

I have had positon play explained a gazzillion times, but honestly, I just don't get it.

I guess the basics to begin is awesome, but to a degree it isn't as simple as posting a senario on the forums to get feedback
However sometimes it is..

I honestly don't play online, because I don't get the same feel for the game, but live is so much more different.

I guess I just want to improve my game beginning from the basics.

Thanks again for the help.