AFL 2011

[gmatical]

I don't think much will change in the state of teams -the AFL has to be fairly happy with how it is going at the moment. Struggling Melbourne clubs have become better at managing money and the only thing really hurting them is crap stadium deals at Etihad - but they will own that in 15 years and this will become a non-issue.

All the current teams have an important place in the competition, and the competition would be worse if any of them went.

A tassie team would be good, but not until the AFL is good and ready (eg GC and GWS have a decent team / following / results).

[gundog]

The problem most people cannot accept is Victoria was the centre of the universe for elite football pre AFL, and biggest offender for not accepting this was the SANFL, it went to great pains to try and stop the talent drain from SA with the player retention payments, which had merit but the so called SA elite were quick to grab the extra cash knowing that they were the big fish in the little pond, because they were never tested against the best of the best week in week out.

Every SA footy follower knows how good Barry Robran was, but most average fans outside of SA had no idea how good he was, would he have become absolute superstars like Bradley, Sticks, Plats if the he had accepted the offers to play in Vic, then theres Cornes and Ebert who alas far to late in their careers went to Nth under Barrasi, Russell played a full season and was successful however Cornes failed only playing 5 games before quitting and returning to SA.

So now the reality the population of Vic cannot continue to support 10 teams likewise SA is not big enough for 2, as much as I hate to say it the Crows brand is far to dominate, which leaves the Port in the shadow of them and Port carries too much baggage, the hatred for attempting to join the VFL and for just being Port. In hindsight any 2nd team would have struggled in such a small market.

What to do with the struggling clubs relocation and mergers are unpalatable to the majority of fans, a lot of the old peckers supporters felt cheated and never went to footy again after the merger with West Torrens, the same with Fitzroy and South Melbourne fans but they came back to the fold when premierships were won. Clubs like Melborne, Nth Melb, Footscray and to a lesser extent Hawthorn have small supporter bases mergers or relocation maybe necessary for thier survival. ( yes as a Dee's member I Voted Yes to the merger with Hawks)

[666HARPS666]

Hawthorn Have 1 of the best members no. in the A.F.L(are in the top 4) & are also 1 of the richest clubs in Australia.

[David]

I don't hold it against the SANFL for resisting the VLF/AFL at all Gundog. Also - there was not much gap between the VFL and SANFL - just look a the state games over the years. I don't think Barrie would have changed a thing, just to be "noted" any more now than he is.

I don't think players raelly cared back then about how well known they were Australia-wide.. and it's more so an indictment on the AFL of recent times for only pushing their own history rather than that around Australia on an equal level. God knows how it took Peter Carey so long to get into the Hall of Fame.

I felt sorry for the Woodville Supporters. As a West Torrens man, I didn't want to merge either, though these things happen. Some say it was a weak move, others think it was the best. West Torrens wouldn't have survived another two seasons, and Woodville would've continuously struggled like they had since '64.

In saying that, Woodville should have never come in - why you would put a side a stones throw from Alberton and West Torrens is beyond me.

(Side note: Malcolm Blight would've been a Port player until the Woodville zone came in)

The SANFL is the best competition outside of the AFL, taking into consideration the passion and history it has, from both within and it's supporters.

The market is weird. We should be able to have two teams here. But, it seems to be an issue - especially with results as they are. It's not like the SANFL where devoted fans will catch the train or bus in the rain to see their team no matter where they are on the ladder. I have two mates (Brothers) who go to every Maggies game no matter what because they are pure dyed-in-the-wool Maggies men.

That doesn't seem to translate in the AFL. The most passion shown like that is from the Melbourne based clubs since, well, they have over 100 years of history in some cases.

Interesting to see you voted yes on the merger Gundog. Was that a hard decision? Do you regret it at all, and, are you happier now that they didn't merge?

More so than any other league, the AFL relies on success for clubs to survive.. but in any competition someone HAS to finish last, you haven't have everyone playing great each year. Hence evening things up with the draft and other methods.

I don't subscribe to the thought that the AFL rewards mediocrity. I think that's the wrong term. Also, said "awards" aren't much of a reward.. look through history (of more recent draft times) and see how many flags were won by the clubs with the most benefits. You still need to get lucky, AND develop the youngsters you get to win a flag.

[AceLosesKing]

AAMI stadium is a bitchhhh to get to, can't wait until that new stadium is bought in.

[rcon]

ok, maybe rewards mediocrity isn't quite right, but it certainly punishes success.

Adelaide should be able to support two teams, port's problem is it specifically set out to alienate large sections of its target audience, and they're only just starting to work on a broader pitch.

I feel far more connected with Bris/Syd/WCE than I do with Port - they all pitch their message at a wide audience. Port tries (tried?, I think they're shifting) to connect only with maggies supporters with, for example, their "creed" message. The 21C and the myriad entertainment options has caught port out.

[bennymacca]

firstly, great post gundog - i like you in this thread when you are constructive.

( yes as a Dee's member I Voted Yes to the merger with Hawks)

this would have been really tough to have to vote on. i suppose you thought that it was a choice between melbourne in some form or not at all. bloody tough decision.

ok, maybe rewards mediocrity isn't quite right, but it certainly punishes success.

its a well trodden path, but the other option is to have an EPL model where you have no hope but to ever win if you are a smaller club, and that is a far worse option then propping up the smaller teams imo.

elaide should be able to support two teams, port's problem is it specifically set out to alienate large sections of its target audience, and they're only just starting to work on a broader pitch.

i felt that when they were up and flying (2004 etc) they were starting to broaden their appeal, but then they insisted on being called PAFC again instead of Power, and they also changed their marketing in order to try and get old maggies supporters back "live the creed" etc, but what they actually did was alienate any SA supporter that wasn't a magpies SANFL supporter.

[gmatical]

So now the reality the population of Vic cannot continue to support 10 teams

Why not?

( yes as a Dee's member I Voted Yes to the merger with Hawks)

As did the majority of Demon voters - thank God Hawthorn members are made of stronger stuff!! I can't fathom why you would want to bin your culture and history for some short term success.

Don Scott & Diamond Joe FTW!

P.S. I think St. Kilda would be the team least missed from the Victorian teams

[trishan]

P.S. I think St. Kilda would be the team least missed from the Victorian teams

Really? North Melbourne must be close, they're like the Port Adelaide of Vic.

[rcon]

AAMI stadium is a bitchhhh to get to, can't wait until that new stadium is bought in.

very much so. heading to a friday night game at docklands you can see what a "natural" part of a night out it can be. Heading to Footy park on the other hand, is more like an adventure that requires planning.