Topic 2. Pot Odds.

[Des]

Someone say straight flush?

[Ondie J]

Dunno about Pete but it'd still depend on a bit for me. If it was a tournament or not. How far along it was if it was and possibly even what my stack looked like. It might also come to my mind on if the open ended was higher/lower, how many people were dealt in and how all the betting was before the pot. Many people initially in the hand that just folded which resulted in a battle of the blinds could very well mean that one or more of your outs are gone if the open ender was low.

But glory is always great fun

[BigPete33]

Here we go...

Ok i wont bother then.

wise choice Mr Des

you seemed to be thinking I said something like 'this is what i think pot odds are' when in fact I said nothing of the sort.

I was merely pointing out that I see some other players completely ignoring most of any pot odds calculation and only seeing how much they might win should they chase that ace and hit it, as though a pair of aces wins every time.

Scot (nokturnl) was leading you all astray and putting words in my mouth but I thought I cleared that up quickly enough for you the first time

[BigPete33]

Someone say straight flush?

If you're hinting at what I think you're hinting at.... let's ask the masses what they would do.....

The situation is thus:

You're already in the points (just), player acting immediately before you has been going allin almost every single hand, often pre-flop, and almost always with a shocking hand but getting lucky. This is also extremely typical of this players style of play, their first name often gets prefixed with 'allin'. You also are aware that almost every single time this player has gone allin for the last several times pretty much everyone will fold, 1 caller at most but usually none.

You are also in the big blind, this other player is small blind. Miraculously this player only completes the small blind instead of going allin and clearly this means nobody else has raised (possibly not even called - can't remember). So, you see a flop!

Guess what happens, the player goes allin (no big surprise here so far right?) you look at what you have and whats flopped and you see a gutshot str8 draw, a gutshot str8 flush draw, and naturally a flush draw (the flop is all hearts and you have a reasonably high heart).

Do you...

a) stop to consider pot odds and maybe ring Des cos he's oh so clever.
b) remember this crazy player has been going allin with rubbish every other hand and is extremely likely to have nothing. So you call.
c) fold like a wuss even though you have a semi-decent chance of actually making a hand.

(I am actually curious to know what option ppl would choose)


I chose option b (I should have made it option c so I could say lock it in eddie)

You wouldn't read about it but somehow this other player managed to avoid going allin preflop with a suited King...of hearts. I looked despondantly down at all my chances of making a hand vanishing and then noticed I still had one out! yay! guess what?? rivered him with the str8 flush on the river. He was filthy, but I thought parity had been restored to the universe. And yep, I went nutso in his face just to rub it in

[Des]

Someone say straight flush?

---Pete's big post---

Not everyone has my number

[Garth Kay]

No your evolving on the topic of pot odds Pete, you are starting to read players and putting them on a range of hands or a style of player which does affect your decision making processes. But this topic was based solely around pot odds and making mathematical decisions. And how to know when you should be calling and when you shouldn't be.
Even in the scenario you have listed, you still don't state blind size, bet size, pot size. Even if I knew the players was loose ag, I would still not put my tournament life on the line here on a draw, unless it wasn't my tournament life but his. Even then I still need to be offered the right pot or implied odds for me to make this call unless I am certain I currently have the best hand with a re draw to the nuts or second nuts. This is the are where pot odds are and knowing your outs is important.

[BigPete33]

that also wasn't an example of pot odds (nor was it meant to be) but rather a response to a comment by Des (who thought I was talking about pot odds when I wasn't - I was really only replying to Scot in case someone decided that what he said must be true), so in reply I thought 'stuff it, let's see what everyone else would do given the facts'

It's all Scot's fault really, he was having a friendly joke and it somehow made you guys think I was saying something that I wasn't.

All good tho, was having a chuckle about it with him last night at the Bremen

[David]

Scott confuses people

[David]

[Garth Kay]

lol, A+ for taking it out of context

What he's on about is I often see/hear people calling not because their cards are actually any good but rather because they'd be getting a good return on their money if they did call.

they seem to miss the fact their cards suck and they have little to no chance of actually winning the hand ie just because you have an ace doesn't mean you're going to win

Sounds like pot odds to me!