Change to the Official 888PL Rules

[trishan]

The ruling made against Trishan was arbitrary.

This is not a ruling against me, it is a ruling that affects the whole 888PL community and especially those who are not part of the forum (as forumers tend to be regular in-venue participants anyway)

This thread shouldn't be about me at all. It should be discussion on whether the potential to make rules based on "fairness" effective immediately is in the best interests of all league players.

[trishan]

This thread shouldn't be about me at all. It should be discussion on whether the potential to make rules based on "fairness" effective immediately is in the best interests of all league players.

I personally don't think it is in the best interests as there is always the potential for arbitrary rule-making but people can have different opinions and that is what this thread ought to be about.

[David]

If it's in the interest of fairness, then yes, it is in the best interests of the players.

I can't see anyone remotely CARING, EVER, if a game wasn't counted because they didn't physically play.

[Garth Kay]

I think it oversimplifies the issue. People should consider the potential such a clause can have on rule-making. The question should be: should the league have the power to make any rule based on "fairness" effective immediately or should there be some period of notice before a rule is changed.

You will find that rule in every poker rule book, we have operated now for over 4 years. At all times we have acted ethically and I have been at the helm of this league for 2 and a half years.
To sit here and be insulted in you accusing us of POTENTIAL FUTURE wrong doings is something I am not going to tolerate any further.

Nor will I tolerate your naive attempts to try and conceal that the true intent behind this thread was for you to garner support for your rhetoric and actions in exploiting a perceived loophole.

Every ruling made and rule or competition change implemented has always been put forth with the best interests of the league at heart and it always will be. As a business we have every right to protect out business and are free to change promotional/competition and league rules to do so. There is no rule citing what time frames must be adhered to but in most cases (for aspects that will have a detrimental and will being major change) we do allow a bedding in and notification period.

In your case, we close your perceived loophole completely and the rule only affects one person at the moment - you. So it will be implemented immediately.

[Garth Kay]

2. Arbitration.
2.1. While the 888PL rules will attempt to cover and regulate any scenario we may find ourselves in, there may occasionally be times in which a decision will require an unbiased independent third party in regard to player behaviour and resulting penalties. In these cases, Mr. Garth Kay (herein referred to as National Poker Manager) will be the arbitrator of these decisions. Once the National Poker Manager has listened to the dispute in question and all pertaining details, he will make a binding non-negotiable decision.

Ethics and Moral Code
3.1. All League players and bystanders must abide by the 888PL Poker rules and Etiquette document. While some events provide cash payouts, our main goal will always be the pursuit of social entertaining poker in a fun and fair environment. Players must always remember to treat each other, as well as all League activities and representatives, with the utmost respect.
3.2. Any major breach of the player code of conduct will result in a suspension and forfeiture of all League Points and rights to prizes.

9.3. A Player who has exited a tournament or is missing from the tournament during the bonus point stages, will not be awarded bonus points.

11. Incentives, Coercion & Bribes.
11.1. Under no circumstances can one Player try to alter or skew the League Point allocations or standings through incentives, coercion or bribes. (For example, the scenario of, “I will give you more money for the position if you lose the tournament so I can get more points”, is 100% prohibited.)

12. The Rules.
12.1. The 888 Poker League will follow the rules as outlined in the 888PL Poker Rules and Etiquette document.
12.2. The rules will be known as the “888 Poker League Rules”.
12.3. Any ruling made by any Tournament Captain, Floor Manager, Supervisor or Tournament Director is final and binding. All decisions will be made with the fairness of the competition in mind and impartial judgement.

[trishan]

You will find that rule in every poker rule book, we have operated now for over 4 years. At all times we have acted ethically and I have been at the helm of this league for 2 and a half years.
To sit here and be insulted in you accusing us of POTENTIAL FUTURE wrong doings is something I am not going to tolerate any further.

Nor will I tolerate your naive attempts to try and conceal that the true intent behind this thread was for you to garner support for your rhetoric and actions in exploiting a perceived loophole.

Every ruling made and rule or competition change implemented has always been put forth with the best interests of the league at heart and it always will be. As a business we have every right to protect out business and are free to change promotional/competition and league rules to do so. There is no rule citing what time frames must be adhered to but in most cases (for aspects that will have a detrimental and will being major change) we do allow a bedding in and notification period.

In your case, we close your perceived loophole completely and the rule only affects one person at the moment - you. So it will be implemented immediately.

Garth I know all this and I am not accusing you of any future wrongdoing. It's about the potential to make bad rulings not whether or not you do.

This rule does not affect me? As I have stated several times I intend to play? Can you please explain how this rule affects me?

[trishan]

At the end of the day Garth, you are a private organisation and any rules you make are binding. I have no right to challenge any ruling or any decision and it is a privilege for me to be allowed to even discuss them.

I personally look forward to playing with you all in venue over the coming weeks and then at the GF.

[AceLosesKing]

Let me get this straight.

You argument is that the way the rule is written out, it gives Garth/888pl head honcho's to right to change rules/affect decisions willy nilly, how they see fit. Yet you've repeatedly said that they are not the sort of people to do that - yet the implication/potential of the rule bothers you, the chance that it might happen.

Do I have that right?

[trishan]

Let me get this straight.

You argument is that the way the rule is written out, it gives Garth/888pl head honcho's to right to change rules/affect decisions willy nilly, how they see fit. Yet you've repeatedly said that they are not the sort of people to do that - yet the implication/potential of the rule bothers you, the chance that it might happen.

Do I have that right?

Yeh it really bothers me as I honestly thought that it was well accepted that a person could (if they wished under the rules) register and then not play. Then when I was told, after highlighting that is was within the rules, that the rules have changed immediately it bothered me. Even though I am a huge supporter of Garth and the 888PL and I don't think they would make stupid rules without good cause, there is always the potential.

Just as I am afraid the Government will act unconstitutionally to enact stupid laws. The thing about the Government is that there are always 3rd party arbitrators in the Courts whereas in the league there is no unbiased 3rd party, which makes me uneasy.

Maybe it's just because I have been brainwashed by the law school and have lost touch with society...I dunno

Edit: So Garth's idea in the other thread becomes more relevant. Who does one complain to if they feel they have been hard done by a provider? At the present no one. So Garth is doing good things on that front.

Edit Edit: The reason this thread has gone so long is because people think I am complaining because I want to reg and the not play which is not true. I want to play in venue because I need the practice. Live v online is very different.

[David]

Yeh it really bothers me as I honestly thought that it was well accepted that a person could (if they wished under the rules) register and then not play

Anybody who wishes they could do that, shouldn't be. We've all agreed that it isn't in the spirit of what the 888PL are trying to do.

And, since you aren't wishing to do that, Trishan, I guess the debate is over